Episode 234: Navigating the Fitness Industry’s Business Landscape with Luka Hocevar

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[00:00:00] Dr Mike T Nelson: Welcome back to the Flex Diet podcast. I’m your host, Dr. Mike T. Nelson. On the podcast, we talk about all things to increase body composition, performance, and strength. And today we’ve got a little bit of a diversion from that. We’re talking more about fitness and the business side of fitness with my buddy Luca Josevar from Vigor Ground.

[00:00:27] And I pretty much just let him go on this podcast, which is great. And if you’ve ever met Luca, this will make perfect sense to you. He talks about a book that he’s in the process of writing now, and his three C’s for fitness and business development, especially. Lots of great stuff here. And if you’re wondering why my voice is a little bit off, I just finished at the NEC conference here.

[00:00:56] Shout out to Jason Lydon Conquer Athlete huge thanks to all the presenters who were amazing. All the people who attended, it was so awesome to see everyone there and to meet everyone. And I did my talk this morning, which is on physiologic flexibility and a little bit on metabolic flexibility.

[00:01:15] So again, I think it’s always great to go to different seminars and if you’re in the business of fitness. Going to live events is always going to be the best in my opinion. I know it’s not always entirely possible, but whenever you can, attending live events is great. If you want more information from me, you can go to MikeTNelson.com/podcast. All the podcasts that I’ve done and guest episodes I’ve been on. You can get on to the newsletter, which is where most of my content goes out. Just scroll down there at MikeTNelson.com/podcast. And enjoy this podcast here with my buddy, Luca Josevar. Make sure to check out all of his stuff.

[00:02:01] You can find him on Instagram at Luca Josevar. If you’re in the area, you can check out Vigor Ground. And we’ll have links to all the stuff that he’s got going on. Enjoy this talk with my buddy, Luca Josevar.

[00:02:21] [00:02:21] Dr Mike T Nelson: Welcome back to the Flex Diet podcast. I’m here today with Mr. Luca.

[00:02:26] How are you today,

[00:02:26] Luka Hocevar: sir? I’m good man. I am halfway through my can of caffeine, oh, the crescendo happening. Wait, what? The CREs was happening. I want it to be at peak levels of caffeine when we do

[00:02:37] Dr Mike T Nelson: this. Ah, what is today’s caffeine source? I’m curious

[00:02:40] Luka Hocevar: now. Oh man. It’s ghost Cherry Limeade. Oh, okay.

[00:02:43] Anybody that knows me knows I’m a energy drink connoisseur. Ah I swirl it around like you would a Merlot 87, sniff it, spit it out, the whole shebang. But but yeah. What are your favorite energy drinks? Definitely I’d say a C four, but ghost has lately been creeping in ghost Swedish fish, by the way.

[00:03:04] Interesting is probably my best one. Interesting ghost. Swedish fish is phenomenal. Definitely on the sweet side, but I like exceptional. Again, I think everybody’s taste buds, they’re a little bit different, but yeah that’s probably my favorite currently. And then a lot of the C fours, I love the c fours, the, they got the Starbursts flavors the orange slice, the whole shebang.

[00:03:22] Dr Mike T Nelson: So yeah, shout out to my buddy Chris Lockwood, who works there and worked on that product. So yeah, it’s great. I like it. There you go. Awesome. Yeah, thank you for being here. Really appreciate it. And then we’re gonna chat a little bit about your book. And it was nice to finally meet you in person at the Raise the Bar seminar, man, which is several months ago now, which seems crazy how fast

[00:03:43] Luka Hocevar: time goes by.

[00:03:44] I know, right? It’s like I, the guys have already hit me up for the next one. That’s how fast it flew by. But it was it was so crazy, man. ’cause like we’ve talked for years. Yeah. And had a couple of close encounters missed each other in Austin, I think, at

[00:03:56] Dr Mike T Nelson: least. Yeah. You were sitting at a coffee shop across, and I just happened to send you a message and I’m like, where are you at?

[00:04:02] And you’re like, oh, I’m in a coffee shop in Austin. I was like, and we figured out the address and you were literally like two blocks away, but you had something going on. And I was at Paleo FX and I had to go run and do a presentation and Yeah. Yeah. It’s just weird.

[00:04:14] Luka Hocevar: So it came full circle, man. I was glad that we finally got to connect which hopefully again, it won’t take that long for us to, to physically meet up again.

[00:04:22] Yeah. And

[00:04:23] Dr Mike T Nelson: I heard you’re gonna learn to kite surf at some point. It’s on your ever growing list of things

[00:04:27] Luka Hocevar: to do. Yeah it’s up there that one’s probably, I’ll have to take it up with you so that it, that doesn’t become the last year of life. Yeah. Yeah. I need expert guidance for sure.

[00:04:40] Dr Mike T Nelson: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, so tell us a little bit about what was the idea for doing a book? ’cause as writing a book is a pain in the ass. Oh boy. I say that as I’m in the process of writing three different ones right now. And yeah. So

[00:04:52] Luka Hocevar: Man sucks. I think it definitely, yeah. I wouldn’t call it a joyful process.

[00:04:58] No, it

[00:04:58] Dr Mike T Nelson: never is. And it never seems to get easier. It gets better. No, but it’s never easy.

[00:05:03] Luka Hocevar: Absolutely not. It’s funny ’cause like I’m, the book is kind, when I say done, I. I still gotta go back and do some edits and resources, and that feels like writing another book. Oh yeah. And it’s been a year and a half, so it’s and I’ve, I’ve had help Sean Hyon helped me with shout out to him.

[00:05:19] Awesome. He is great. And he’s awesome. And and still it’s whoa. And, I think the reason I’d actually like to ask you that too, the reason for writing the book, I think there’s a lot of reasons to write the book. I’m not gonna judge any of the reasons. I think some folks write it because it’s I need a business card, yeah. And I’ve done a couple of those where I write chapters for certain books and they’re collabed books. And that was the point Hey, I’ve been in a book, I look back and I do a little bit of cringe. I thought the work was good, but it was like cringe. The reason why I did it a little bit more on the marketing side, but this book was actually like one of those moments where you go, I gotta get this stuff outta me.

[00:05:52] I got two, basically two books in me that I knew I had to do and write, and then it was like, Which one do I write first? And it was I just felt like the relevancy of it for this one, which. By the way, it might not be called this, actually, this is the first place I’m saying it. Oh, wow. Ever.

[00:06:08] We might change it, but I do think it’s gonna go this way where it’s the Fit Pro’s Business Success Playbook, and I play basketball, so I’ve always thought about this X’s and O’s, the cover has this playbook on, on how to succeed. And it’s for coaches, ’cause folks will say Hey, you should probably do a gym owner book. And I was like, the only, the last chapter is oh, so you wanna start a gym? That’s the last chapter. And it has I think that chapter could be a mini book about starting a successful gym, bringing it to cashflow, profitable.

[00:06:34] But the rest of it is really for any coach. ’cause I think it’s principle based, I wanted to write a book that’s principle based that has, yeah, all the current, there’s strategies and tactics in it. So whether it’s social media, the different ways that you can deliver the content.

[00:06:47] But the thing is, below that, it’s principles, right? So if in 10 years, Maybe there’s different platforms, maybe there’s different technologies, but the principle of it is the same. That’s why I always tell people if you wanna get good at marketing or influence, persuasion, it’s like you study the kind of foundations of it, and you go back and you read, copywriting from the greats, right?

[00:07:10] And you read marketing from the greats, and then all the stuff that’s new as far as platforms go, that’s easier to figure out. It’s like training, right? Like you understand you or nutrition, like you learn the principles in depth and then it’s easier to stack methods, tactics, strategies on top of that.

[00:07:28] And I, I think that’s unfortunate sometimes that in our field there’s a lot of that surface. What’s the thing, what’s the tactic, what’s the strategy? But with a, without a deeper understanding of, I. Just like the body, in business and marketing, it’s the same thing.

[00:07:42] Understand the principles. And for me, like I, I was I did a presentation at my own summit years ago, and that’s what kind of made me turn it into the book because I was like, you know what? If there’s, what’s the three things that I feel like you gotta have? I don’t care if you’re a one-on-one coach.

[00:07:58] I don’t care if you have a, you’re, you are working out of another place. If you start your own gym, there’s these, I believe, three Cs that are foundational to your success, and that is coaching, which is our, that’s our craft, right? Yeah, absolutely. That’s literally the thing that we, you know that we do our skillset.

[00:08:15] But then there’s these two other ones that are I’ve done my best to operationalize them in the book, right? ’cause sometimes they’re talked about like in the ether which is customer experience and culture and culture, if you wrap it up in one sentence to me is like how we do things around here.

[00:08:29] And. Unfortunately, you can also do things in a shitty way around here, and then people leave and go don’t go there. And so I, I really thought about it and I said for any coach that’s starting off, I think that’s the thing that you want to do. First, those three, and to be honest, I, I’ve seen businesses in my business from the start, it was like, I just put so much effort into those that my business grew, the word of mouth, the referrals that did such a job that it took it to a certain place.

[00:08:56] And then the other three Cs to me is hey, if you want to build a business bigger and you wanna, obviously scale it and have more predictability in your lead generation and marketing and sales and things like that, yeah. Then you, and you wanna build a brand, which I think is important.

[00:09:11] I think it is important. We can talk about that a little bit. Then you gotta have things like, content and marketing, actual marketing that. Is clear and concise about how you can help people, you know who you are, how you can help people, what to do next. Which is a lot of kinda like what I love from Donald Miller.

[00:09:28] ’cause it’s very simple. It’s simple to understand. And same thing with sales. Like your business lives and dies by sales. And, in this industry I’ve seen a lot of really good coaches that had some type of I would say deeper disconnect with money or, I would say not a great relationship with money and or didn’t practice the skill of selling.

[00:09:48] And they didn’t, su succeed. Either they didn’t succeed or they didn’t succeed as nearly as much as they could have, right? Because they didn’t have that. O over the course of now, it’s been almost 20 years of me coaching, we started the first gym in Sylvania 17 years ago.

[00:10:02] This has been a lot of trial and error and failure slash lessons that, that have brought me to this place. And I wanted to create this playbook for coaches. Do I like, look man like this? We live in a era today, when I started, 90% of the things that we use today wasn’t even around, right?

[00:10:16] Yeah. The social media platforms, the things we’re now, the, for instance I built a studio inside of my gym, for an amount of money that, the guy that was helping me build it, he said, Hey, look, he said this switcher, and he’s shown me this switcher, between cameras and stuff like that.

[00:10:30] He said, Luca, 10 years ago, this switcher was $35,000. This switcher. And I’m like, what? He’s yeah, like that’s how much it cost. He’s literally this. He said, that’s like 2018 to 20 grand. Like this would’ve been like 150 to 200,000. Like you couldn’t, and you would’ve had to have a team to operate this, and it’s now, honestly, you don’t need that. You need that. You got this damn phone. Yeah. You know what I mean? That’s it. And you could pretty much run a business from it. Which there’s a lot of benefits to that, but I think it’s also become a handicap a little bit. Because I grew up in an era where, I was like sticking yard signs in, or two weeks free trial, I was talking to people all day long. I was doing lunch and learns it ba basically, and I do wanna touch, touch base on this a little bit, which is part of the book, is that I think because of technology and the ease of technology, that people have lost their way of, what some would call gorilla marketing or boots on the ground, Low cost, no cost.

[00:11:26] Marketing. By the way, there’s always a cost. Cost is your time and energy. Time, yeah. Not money. And I feel that the best thing is to gel the, what people consider the old with the new. It’s not like an either or. It’s an and it amplifies each other. And when I, again, building up the book and thinking about those three C’s, and remember putting it out in that first presentation, and so many people came to me, and were just like, dude, you gotta write a book about this, right?

[00:11:49] And I was like, ah, okay. Because it just it was clear, right? The C’S were just like, people think in threes. It’s that’s, Donald Miller talks about this in StoryBrand all the time. You make three to five points, but be, it’s better if it’s three, right? And it’s okay, what’s the foundation?

[00:12:03] What’s these three C’s and what, what’s the next step? Like what, how do we scale and enhance it? Okay, it’s these next three C’s. The thing that I didn’t go into I went into a little bit, but is. Now if you build a company, hiring leadership and putting people on your team, I think there, there’s room for another book there, but but I really wanted to make it for, coaches in this industry.

[00:12:23] And the reason why is because it has, this industry still has such a high turnover, but I still, I feel it’s the best industry in the world. What we do and how much we can influence people, I think is incredible. I may be biased because again, we’ve, between our two gyms, we’ve now had I think 12,000 people come through that we’ve coached to, to success.

[00:12:41] And just one every time, like after all these years, when somebody goes Hey man, like my life changed once I came here. And, it was just three years later, I’ve not just lost weight, but got confidence, sustainable, this, that, I, that never gets old to me. It never becomes like, oh yeah, okay, it’s just another one.

[00:12:57] I always get this. Feeling this high. And when I look at it, it’s like we’re probably in the worst place we’ve been health-wise as a country. And you can’t go to the macro level necessary and change anything, but on a micro level, right? In your community, these people that come through our gyms, or if you do online coaching or if you’re in person, and you’re out of another place, like you, you affect that one person.

[00:13:21] And then that person’s a lighthouse for maybe their kids and their family. And their friends are like, oh, you got in shape. So it start, it it’s a ripple that creates a wave and influences more people. Now if you do that with a hundred people, a thousand people, you’ve affected maybe thousands if you do stuff online, which was one of my kind of driving forces is that, now there’s half a million people on these different platforms that follow me.

[00:13:42] Okay, cool. I can influence in a positive way. And that’s what that’s where this whole thing came from is Hey, how can I help? Creative, a framework for people to be successful. ’cause here’s the deal, if you’re in the industry for three years and you affect X, Y, z people, but if you’re in industry for 30, right?

[00:13:58] That’s 10 x and that’s gonna compound and you’re gonna coach more people and your brand’s gonna grow. Now you might have affected, a hundred thousand people. Now, if we can get, a hundred thousand coaches to affect a hundred thousand people over their lifetime man that’s some pretty gnarly impact.

[00:14:12] And that’s where it all stemmed from. And it was like a, I have to write this book. It wasn’t like a, alright, let me sit down and see strategically how, because as it is a, it’s man, it’s a ton of work. It’s a ton of work. It’s not for the light of heart. And you gotta there, there’s days where you’re like, oh dude, I don’t know if I wanna write this book.

[00:14:31] And you just keep going. So that’s really where it started. But I, to dive into those foundational Cs. ’cause I wanna give, I think it’s important to give some Principles, but also like tactical, strategic stuff, right? And for example, on the coaching part, like what coaching, I was actually just talking to Brett bartolo me about this, right?

[00:14:50] Like what are the kind of, again, back to the three components, three components of coaching, right? Number one, all coaching is underpinned by communication. It’s a social, so coaching is a social interaction underpinned by communication. That’s actual scientific term for it, right? So there is no coaching without communication and social interaction.

[00:15:08] So there’s three things. There’s communication, there’s problem solving, and then there’s the technical expertise, right? And I think, by the way, I think the technical expertise is very important. That’s your program design under standing, biomechanics, understanding, biophysiological changes and the said principle and the progressive role of principle and all these different things.

[00:15:26] Yes, you gotta know ’em. And it’s coaching and queuing Hey, how many different tools do I have in my toolbox to coach this Ardi l. But I, Hey, but I gotta know anatomy to know if they’re in a crappy position like that. That’s really important. And I think that the pendulum has swung. So I think there’s some people that are really good at that stuff.

[00:15:44] And I think there’s some people that suck at that, right? And the people that suck at that should get better at it. And the people that are really good at that usually need a lot more of communication, problem solving, right? Because the problem solving is twofold. It’s somebody comes in and Hey, you know what?

[00:16:01] I’ve got this issue. My knee’s filling a certain way, this, that, and the other, right? And now you can problem solve from a standpoint or how to change the exercises, you know how to modify and not make them feel like crap. Like they can’t do stuff. Problem solving might be on the nutritional end, right?

[00:16:15] You created a plan. Things aren’t going to plan, but you know how to problem solve, right? And you’re good at going Hey, okay, this isn’t working out. Which one of these three different ways that help other clients that I coach. Seems the best fit for you, right? So you give ’em some autonomy, boom, and they take that, right?

[00:16:32] So developing problem solving skills, which some of it is, learning. And then some of it is just experience like on on the battlefield, right? Meaning you gotta get your reps in. There’s no way that you can be in the books and do the theory and go haha, I got it. You’ve gotta coach, you’ve gotta coach a lot.

[00:16:49] A lot, right? And then you have the communication part, which I believe could probably be the one that’s the most under let’s just say underutilized from a standpoint that when I go in and I fly around the country and do consulting for gyms and speak and this, that and the other, and I’ll say stuff like, all right, we talk about these three Cs and we talk about coaching and communication.

[00:17:12] And they’re like, yeah, that’s really important. Okay, how much have you guys practiced this? And they’re like, what do you mean? Said, okay, you’ve had an in staff, did you work on communication skills? And they’re like n no. Okay. Do you have what are the tools that you’re going through?

[00:17:28] Maybe, did you read Crucial Conversations and go through course and then worked on it together as a team with a role play? No. So then it becomes like, whoa, the thing that’s really important, actually, it’s the underpinning of coaching. Literally, scientifically, right? You’re practicing it zero.

[00:17:49] Now somebody will go no, but every day I’m talking to people and I’m doing this, that, and the other. Yeah. But the thing is, how are you doing that? You’re doing it as well as you know how to right now. And I’ll give a, an example of I don’t know if Craig Weller that was with Precision Nutrition, but yeah, Craig told, I know Craig, he’s awesome.

[00:18:04] He’s awesome. And he, and told his story about surfing, that he surfed for many years. And he was like I was mediocre at best, right? And he said, then I went to this surf camp for a week. And I improved 10 x. But the thing is that what I realized that for years I was practicing crappy habits.

[00:18:22] Yeah. So I got really good at being shitty at some things, and that became, that’s why he’s I couldn’t grow, I couldn’t progress through that, even though I was putting in a lot of hours what I thought. I didn’t know what I didn’t know. And so this is what’s happening a lot of times with communication.

[00:18:39] Communication is a million different things. It’s listening, it’s body language. It’s again, active listening. It’s how to respond. It’s how you ask questions. It’s, verbal, nonverbal. You have a lot of different things that, that fall under your line. But my point is that people are like, yeah but I’m talking to clients a lot.

[00:18:54] I’m doing this a lot. But what you’re doing is what Craig was doing with surfing, which is you’re practicing probably a lot of bad habits and you don’t even know what you’re doing. That’s not great. And you’re just repeating it over and over. It’s actually harder to get out of that. And so there has to be, a training and a, this is why, that’s why I’m such a curious person.

[00:19:16] I’m obsessed with, this industry and with coaching, because it’s like, Hey, I might be doing some things shitty and I’ve just repped it like a hundred thousand times now I’m gonna have to break that pattern. So you have to first, create awareness around your weak links. I would say, aware assessment proceeds awareness and awareness proceeds change.

[00:19:35] And what could be an assessment, I love like record yourself coaching. I ask the client like, Hey, is it cool? I’m, I wanna record this session. I’m not gonna put it out anywhere as just for me so I can see how I’m doing and improve myself. Guess what? Nine outta 10 will say, yes, no problem.

[00:19:49] Or, lapel mics now, they’re, they cost nothing. And legitimately you can, maybe you don’t get a vis a visual of it, but you get a audio and you record your whole session. And here’s the other thing. You can assess it, but somebody else can assess it. That’s what I’ve done too in, in my business and my coaching, where I’m saying, Hey, listen, record this, or record the sales stuff, right?

[00:20:11] Like I say, Hey, look, record the sales stuff. It’s not going out to anybody. We’re gonna listen to it. We’re gonna break it down. We’re gonna find opportunities, how to improve, be like, Hey, see what you did here. All right. What’s another way that you could have done this? But we’ll go through training of what’s a better way, right?

[00:20:26] And I’m bringing this up because I would love to, like Mike, if you were like, let’s talk training, dude, record the podcast for a week because it’s, I love it. Like I’m a geek about that stuff, right? But I would say that I’ve, yeah, again, when I said those three components, I think some people need a lot more work on a technical side.

[00:20:45] But let me tell you this, almost everybody needs work on the communication side of coaching. Okay? I’ve done this for so long and I’ve, I’ve been like obsessed for the last decade about this. I feel like I’m just getting started with it right now. Now my point is that you can never get too good at that.

[00:21:06] And when I remember when I was working at Vision Quest and I, when I veer off with stories, I always connect the dots so that you’re not going like, where the hell is this dude going with this? I worked at a big box gym after LA Fitness called Vision Quest, and I was doing really well.

[00:21:19] I was meaning, I was having a lot of clients and whatnot, but, I always, I was looking at one coach that like, her expertise of the technical side was honestly like probably a two to three outta 10, right? Her retention was amazing. She probably 60 to seven and this is a big box gym, right?

[00:21:36] So I would say 60 to 70% of her clients she had for like years and years, which is. Even more difficult when you don’t have your own place and culture. So this is out of a big box gym and I was just like, dude, what the, my, of course my judgment side pops up ’cause I’m like, you know what the hell?

[00:21:53] Dude, I’m like, studying this stuff inside and out. Like I’ll run circles around what is going on? Like, how is she doing this? UN until I started just observing and I would talk to her and I’d see what she would do, how she would talk to people. She was really good at listening, like exceptionally good at listening to where it was just like, she’d ask a question, the person would talk and talk and ask a question.

[00:22:14] And just body language was al always, she was always like this, right? Just leaning in. Okay. Like you could look at her and go she is legitimately trying to understand and she’s curious. And the thing is, she didn’t even, she didn’t know what she was doing. But I started recognizing what she was doing.

[00:22:30] She’d always take the little extra time to sit down with people and then she’d be like, yeah, I’m gonna call her tomorrow, see how she’s feeling. I send an email. So I started seeing oh, like the communication aspect. And by the way, some of the things I’m also mentioning is customer service.

[00:22:47] She was a nine outta 10 on that. But her technical expertise was like, let’s give it a, let’s give her a three. But what happened is that these folks would keep coming back for years and they would get results because guess what? They’re just consistent. And they would keep coming back. And that was such a huge aha moment for me.

[00:23:04] Because, and for somebody that’s like a me head, I. Former pro athlete that geek out obsess obsesses about training, to get to this point, to go man, like you could actually not have a lot of technical expertise and get great results and people would love you. Now again, I don’t think it’s a either or.

[00:23:24] I think it’s, and that’s an important distinction, but that’s where I really started getting into, that side of of the communication side and going okay, how do you connect those dots? And by the way, back then, I didn’t believe in those three. I didn’t know and categorize those three Cs yet, but it started all making sense, right?

[00:23:42] Because you start looking at which coach is successful. And by the way, I think one of the greatest things that you can do as a coach, let’s say, if you’re anybody that’s listening to this that works out of another gym, okay? Or you work for, I don’t know, a gym like mine, or you are work training out of your garage.

[00:24:00] Garage, here’s what I would highly encourage you to do. Find the person that’s got the most clients for the longest period of time and is like the best trainer in their gym. If you’re not there, hire them. If you’re working with them, follow them and do everything that they do, right? Me and Kyle Dobbs talks, talked about this on my show, and it was like, he said I found the guy that was crushing it when he was an Equinox, and I realized it’s like he was there at five.

[00:24:26] So I started coming there at five and he stayed till this time. So I stayed till this time, and he said, nine months later I’m packed. But he was like, he did this, so I did this, he did this, so I did that. So you want to cheat code, find the people that are crushing it and just observe what they’re doing, and ideally ask them because they’ll share it with you.

[00:24:49] But my point being is, in, in that scenario, this girl, what I was looking at, I was going like, she’s doing some things I’m not doing. I could be like, she doesn’t know what I know in training, but she was having a lot of success with something that I wasn’t doing as well. And thankfully it made me aware and I was just like, oh man, I need to pick that up.

[00:25:08] Because I could argue left and right. But at that point in time, she was doing the most sessions with the most people, making the most money and getting the really, if you think about it, the best results. ’cause she had this longevity of her clients, right? So now it’s like mirror that, like mirror success, I think is so smart and underutilized.

[00:25:28] And then again, since we’re talking about the communication and customer experience, because I think those are such huge gaps for most businesses. And I talk about this in the book, right? Customer experience is so bad in America as far as businesses go that this is this really profound study, right?

[00:25:46] When they asked companies, and it was a big study, they asked companies, How many, the percentage of people of companies that believe that they have great customer service and over 80% of the company said, we believe we have great customer service. Then they went to the customers of those said companies, guess how many said that they believe their company had a great customer service?

[00:26:09] Probably 38%. No. Talk about like having a dissonance between reality and what they think. Like 10 x slower. Imagine that you’re sitting there going huh, yeah, you know what? Our customers service is pretty damn good, but it’s 10 times lower. That’s insane.

[00:26:28] That’s absurd. That’s absurd. ’cause one of the things that the studies show is this, right? That if that you can make customer service and experience a competitive advantage. Where it’s if all things are equal, and even if they’re not, like if I’m, my training is like a five out 10 and another person’s like a nine outta 10, but my customer experience is a nine out 10 and theirs is a four out of 10.

[00:26:49] Customer experience wins. And here’s one of the reasons why. If you go to most people that come to my gym, bigger ground, or you go to bigger box gym and you said, tell me what a a good and or a great training program is, will they be able to tell you no, because they’re not experts, right? They don’t have that expertise.

[00:27:09] Just like if somebody showed me, a law document and said, we’re gonna defend with this document, this person in this case, what’d you think? I’d go through it and be like, yeah, I think that’s fine. I don’t know that stuff. So this is the mistake, right? The mistake is that coaches a lot of times are like, huh, my program is superior, right?

[00:27:30] And this other person’s Doesn’t know as much about training, but they’re like, man, I gotta make sure this person’s treated excellent. That their experience is awesome. They gotta feel cared for, they gotta feel appreciated. The latter person is gonna win in a game of business, right?

[00:27:45] Because people wanna be heard, understood, appreciated, seen. And if you can do that, they don’t really understand the training part. Now, by the way I believe if you’re a coach, you should get great at that stuff. ’cause I think if you don’t, I think it’s unethical, but I’m just giving the reality of, the world of coaching and business.

[00:28:04] And so if customer service is so bad, I end up going like, how great of an opportunity is it for you to be able to elevate your business through that? And if we go into tactical stuff of customer service, I think even starting with onboarding, right? When you look at onboarding and you go okay, From the time that somebody reaches out to you what is everything that happens?

[00:28:29] Actually, let’s go even beyond that, right? Before they reach out to you, what happens? And coaches always say what do you mean? I say they had to see something or hear something to reach out. So what happened? So you gotta start breaking that stuff down. Now, if it’s word of mouth and referral, great.

[00:28:44] But you should ask, Hey, what made you reach out to us? How did you hear about us? I always say that ’cause you never know what they’re gonna say. Oh. Like I go over across the brag to the salon and the lady of the salon, said that this is a great spot. And I’d be like, I awesome. Thank you.

[00:29:01] Appreciate that. Guess what? I’m gonna go over there. Thank her. Give her a gift card and also be like, Hey, you know what? Really appreciate that. Would love to give you two weeks of training with me on me. So you create opportunities, but guess what I want? I wanna do more of that. That works.

[00:29:15] So let me do more of that. But my point being is that Customer service starts with marketing, right? And people are like, whoa, what’d you mean? What I mean is that when people see your marketing content the value to deliver in the marketplace, they’re already judging you. And that is already creating their customer experience, right?

[00:29:34] So imagine that you’re like, Hey, I’m gonna follow Luca. Damn, this guy’s like giving valuable advice two to three times a day. Oh, she, he’s got a YouTube channel, Jesus Christ, 1600 videos. Oh, he’s got a podcast. Oh right? Let me go to the site. Whoa. Blog every week. Jesus. So now, but here’s what’s happening now.

[00:29:51] They’re consuming this, and every piece is valuable. Like I’m doing, I’m creating something useful and valuable for the reader. So now this is already part of their experience. They haven’t reached out yet, right? But at a certain point in time, they’re consuming this content and then going, you know what?

[00:30:09] I need to get in shape. I need to get fitter. I need to get stronger. I. I’m gonna go who’s, who are they gonna reach out to? The person that’s already been helping them right through their content and marketing or somebody that they’ve never heard of. The answer’s easy. So this is why I’m such a big fan of content and understanding of marketing because you actually go, hey, like customer experience and service starts the moment you start marketing and doing content.

[00:30:32] Look at two gyms in the area and one has an active blog, an email newsletter that sends out an email once or twice a week. A very engaged social media so you can go all the time and see what’s going on. They do live seminars and workshops at their place, and the other gym barely does any of that.

[00:30:50] It’s like today people shop without coming in and asking you questions. What do they do? Google your website, social media account, and then they start checking it out, right? They’re seeing what people are saying. Google reviews. How many do you have? What about this? Is this up to date? They go to the page and it’s oh, the last video was posted a month and a half ago and it’s got 50 views.

[00:31:12] Like thi this is just the reality of how people operate. So you have to understand that, right? So it starts there, but then the moment that they reach out, it becomes what happens when they filled out the form? How long did it take for you to get back to them? In the fitness industry, actually, in every industry is bad, but in the fitness industry sometimes it’s oh yeah, I got back to them like a day later or two days later.

[00:31:32] Whoa, listen that in, in the real estate industry, if you don’t call back within five minutes, every 10 minutes afterwards, the percentage of them basically picking up goes down further and further. Right? In physical therapy, we have a in-house physical therapy clinic that we partner with and lease out high.

[00:31:51] That physical therapy, if basically, their world is like this, somebody calls them, they don’t pick up, they’re picking up the next, they’re calling the next pt. Because I gotta put, my back’s hurting. I gotta fix it. Okay, I heard some things about you guys, but you know what? I gotta go to the next one, to the next one, to the next one, right?

[00:32:11] So it’s if you can respond to people, and again, this is where software can come into play, right? Somebody calls you, leaves a voicemail, but what if they get automated text back to schedule a Calendly, for example, right? And then as soon as somebody can call ’em back, they call ’em back. Your conversion dramatically increases and the customer experience goes up because now this person goes whoa, they’re on top of it, right?

[00:32:36] I called, yeah, I didn’t get them, but instantly I got an email, I got auto responder. It’s like something happened, right? And again, in our industry, I think sometimes we’ve become a little bit too complacent because it’s one of those things where it’s just I’m really busy, so they’ll just have to wait.

[00:32:52] In other industries, you’d be done crushed. Again, example of PT or real estate, like these are just the real numbers. So if you can get back to them fast and set up something fast, you’re in a better space also, because how many times, has somebody gone especially with interruption marketing, right?

[00:33:09] They’re on Facebook, they see your video and you’re like, oh man, you know what? This guy’s great. I keep watching his stuff. I really do need to get in shape. They fill out the form, right? And then you don’t contact them for a day and a half and they’re like pretty motivated. They fill the form out, they’re ready to go.

[00:33:24] Next morning, they wake up, kids are running all over the place, you know they’re gonna go for a workout or a walk. There’s another bill on the table. They freak out. They completely forgot about filling out the form. That’s already now thing number four, right? But if you call them right away, set something up, followed up, all of a sudden it stays top of mind and you can get them at this place where we can now get them.

[00:33:46] In through the doors, build some competence and confidence and help them succeed. All these little things like really add up and it’s stuff that can completely, change your business and then it, it goes down to what was your, we call it a strategy session, right? When a person comes in where we call it a blueprint transformation, which is we’re gonna outline how we’re gonna help you achieve results.

[00:34:05] How was that experience? How was the assessment that you took them through the next day? Did you follow up? Hey, I know we talked about you being sore and doing some drills and make sure you hydrate. But I’m just calling to see how you’re feeling, right? Oh, wow. Boom. Customer experience, it’s a little thing that goes a long way.

[00:34:22] I always tell coaches like, you should have at least, 30 to 60 days outlined of your onboarding process so that everybody knows what happens. If somebody signs up, they get a gift box one that you don’t tell them about, I call it the 70 30 rule, tell people 70% of what they’re gonna get.

[00:34:39] Don’t tell ’em 30% of what they’re gonna get. So 30% is just whoa, I get what a smoothie. Holy shit. So you’re constantly creating this over-delivery of expectations and that can be structured and built in, right? That shouldn’t be. When I started, I was doing those things in the first years, but it was very much so in my head, right?

[00:35:01] When you build a team or you have a process and you have another coach, or you have an admin or whatever else you have this should be a system, right? A system that people can follow. And when you have the system, what happens is that you can see the faults, right? If something isn’t working well, you can go oh, we let’s improve that, let’s change that.

[00:35:17] Whoa, we’re, we’re only getting three outta 10 leads in to sit down with us. So we gotta look at our process of follow up. We gotta look at our process of how fast we call this person. Are we calling them? Are we texting them? Do we find ’em on social media and send a message?

[00:35:32] Those are all little intricacies that if you build on it can alter your business, right? Because think about when we go to the numbers game, and if you were, for every 10 leads that you got, five came in and you closed three, right? Or maybe you closed two. And now because you made that process better and you had a referral system as well, now those, 10 leads turn to 12 leads, and then seven come in and you close five, right?

[00:36:03] But over the course of 12 months, you are talking about 25 more clients. If that’s 25 more clients at 300 bucks a month, you’re, that’s almost a six figure increase. But it wasn’t like one massive thing that you did. It was little things in every area that you improved.

[00:36:23] It’s like that. It was like the story of the cycling team, right? Where the coach was like, Hey, we’re gonna improve, our wind resistance by a percent because we’re gonna improve the helmets a little bit and then we’re gonna improve, 3% on the efficiency of our riders, right?

[00:36:38] So again, that we’re, we are in that wind tunnel and then we’re gonna improve the cleats a little bit so we can distribute force a little better. And it was like seven or eight things that improved by a percent or two. But then when it comes came to the Olympics, they crushed it by 30%, right? ’cause it compounds.

[00:36:54] And you have to look at, your business and your customer experience in that same way where it becomes, hey, like how can we make these little improvements here and there that actually snowball into much bigger changes when it comes to results of the clients experience of the clients. And then obviously at the end, you know what’s important, which is the profits of the business, right?

[00:37:14] I know that was a handful there, but this is what happens. If you get some caffeine in me and talking about this stuff. ’cause I love it. Yeah. I think of

[00:37:22] Dr Mike T Nelson: The process, the analogy I’ve used is, it always seems like people want a bigger bucket, but they’ve got a leaky bucket to start with.

[00:37:32] I want more leads, I want more people seeking me out, I want more customers. And that’s great. Cool. But then when you look at their process, you realize, oh, what’s your conversion? Oh, it’s 30%. Okay. How many people did you follow up on to get in your facility to even talk to ’em? Oh, it’s 20%.

[00:37:51] It’s like you’re better off plugging all the holes in your bucket first, and then you can worry about doing what else. Or if it’s online, you can, people are like, wow, want more traffic? Okay, great. What for, what is the end goal of that traffic? Are you trying to get ’em to a page? Are you trying to get ’em to do something?

[00:38:08] If your conversions are horrible, then. You’re just gonna spend a lot of money on traffic. And if you get it, you’re not gonna see that big increase. It’s gonna go up a little bit, but you’re better off fixing those holes first, and then you can worry about trying to scale and go after more volume.

[00:38:24] Luka Hocevar: Yeah. And here’s the thing, it’s always simpler. I think we’re in a world of new right now, right? What I mean by new is that coaches will go, what’s the new thing that I can do that will get me a quick results? Yeah. And I, we, we literally had a mastermind with our gym owners this past weekend, and I said, look, first it’s more and better.

[00:38:45] Okay? And before you ever go to new, and what I mean by that, I’ll give you an example follow up is a, huge problem again with most businesses. In fitness, let’s say you get a lead and you follow up, day 1, 2, 3, maybe up to day seven and week two maybe you’re already falling off track.

[00:39:01] And then after that you don’t even follow up, right? Whereas follow up should be like week one is every day. Week two is every other day. Week three, it becomes every week. And then after a month, it’s every 30 days. But that’s a system. And that should be, whether you have a C R M system. But I promise you, the amount of clients that fall through pe people’s cr through the cracks of businesses because of lack of follow-up is insane.

[00:39:23] It, the, it’s in obs. Legitimately, you could be making tens of thousands of dollars more per year if only you had better follow up, right? So that means that what do you have to do? You have to do more follow up, right? So more first, or when it comes to, for example, this is another one that people go Luca, I don’t understand, like you’re doing this and this.

[00:39:43] I said, okay, cool. Are you emailing every week to your list? Yeah. Here and there. I said, okay so you’re not consistent with even once a week, let’s get you consistent with once a week and then go to twice a week. But now what hap So that’s more, and then it might be better. So I’ll look at their emails and go woo.

[00:39:59] This too long, too big, too clunky. What are we trying to do? I love Ben Settle when it comes to email. So it’s yeah, Ben’s awesome. He’s great, right? 250 to 400 max words, edutain. So educate and entertain. Don’t, most of the time don’t pitch, but this is where Dean Jackson super signature comes in, right?

[00:40:16] So at the end of every email you go, the PSS is like, whenever you’re ready, here’s three ways I can help you. And that’s where you go Hey, join our 30 day results in advance program. Listen to my podcast for free. Download this, manual that will help you, do a kitchen makeover, for example.

[00:40:31] So now I just entertain and educated, and then at the bottom I had a call to action, but it was very soft. It was like, Hey, whenever you’re ready, right? Hey, if you’re not ready right now, don’t click anything. But when you are, here’s three ways I can help. But now, if you were barely emailing the moment you start emailing one time a week, I.

[00:40:47] You now have a call to action and a lead generator once a week. The moment you start emailing twice a week, you’ve just doubled that. Now you have eight. If there’s five weeks, 10 opportunities in that month to generate leads, you didn’t do anything new. You just improved. Made it better, right?

[00:41:04] ’cause you have a better framework and you just did more of it. And I would say that 80% of the stuff lives in the more and better space for people, and then if you’ve squeezed and maximized things, then you go to new. But of course when you don’t have a if you don’t have a lot of patience and you want everything fast, then you always go to new, Ooh ooh, I saw this new marketing strategy.

[00:41:29] But the truth is that like you really, things compound. Everybody understands financial compounding, right? Oh, the dollar compounds and I put it in and it’s working for me. But listen, so does health, so does. Assets of content. If you wrote blog, be, before there was social media, I wrote, hundreds of blog posts, whether it was for other people or for myself.

[00:41:50] And that stays on your website and it becomes ss e o and it has calls to action, right? Like when you create a piece of content, like even for Instagram, I post it on four different things. Six months later I can repost it again, right? It, it becomes an asset and it compounds. And the, here’s the thing, the people that watch it, there’s a relational equity compounding.

[00:42:12] So if over the course of a year somebody’s Hey, I watched 200 of Lucas’s videos and read 50 emails. Wrote this many this many I would say read this many blog posts. And I listened to 50 podcasts. With all of that, it’s created a bunch of relational equity. So when I launch a product or I’m like, Hey, I’m opening this thing up, I.

[00:42:29] That’s gonna, all that work is gonna compound and you’re gonna have a better result with whatever it is that you’re pitching and selling, whatever it may be. So I think it’s really important. I’m a such a look forward and have a target and then reverse engineer my behaviors type of person, and then be patient, and then dedicate yourself to the process and detach from the outcome to a degree.

[00:42:50] And there, there’s been a, there’s been a quote I’ve been saying lately that I love, I’ve been telling everybody, I said, look, direction is more important than destination, right? I like that. If if you are going in a right direction, I promise you’ll get to where you want to go and probably beyond, right?

[00:43:05] But if you, the thing is that when you just focus on destination and you’re always like, I’m not there yet. I’m not there yet. You go to new, what’s the new thing that can get me there quick? I. You’re constantly detaching from the process and the process is all that matters. ’cause that’s where your best work is done.

[00:43:21] That’s where you connect to people. Even again, on a micro level, to me, the process is, oh wow I’m coaching these three semi-private clients right now. Be where your feet are. And so all I’m caring about is them right there. Connect with them. I’m like, Hey guys, listen, we’re gonna have a hard session today.

[00:43:39] I already got smoothies set up for you at the end of the session, right? Let’s earn these smoothies. And I’m connecting, I’m being present. I’m coaching the hell out of them. Like I’m making ’em laugh. I’m pushing them. I’m challenging them. I’m empowering them, right? And like at the end of the session, boom here’s the smoothie.

[00:43:52] Awesome. High fives. Follow what the text sh send them something like, man, just remember three months ago you were doing a kettleball goblet squat with 30 fives. Today you did 62 and you doubled your reps. So proud of you should be proud of yourself. These are the little things. But those folks are going and telling, they’re fr they’re going home and going oh my God, I love my gym.

[00:44:11] It’s so awesome. And they’re like, what do you mean? It’s oh, my coach is so empowering and enthusiastic and dah. Oh, you know what? I really need a coach too. Come with me next week. That’s the process. But if you are there already, you’re in a session and your mind is somewhere else, oh my God, like my rev, my business is not doing enough.

[00:44:27] I need more clients. You’re not where your feet are and you can’t be in the process. Just as if you’re like, I wanna run this quick ad and it’ll gimme a hundred leads. I’m like, okay. Have you created a bunch of content for the marketplace? To retarget, to have engagement? Have no.

[00:44:41] I’m like, man you gotta do that. Aria always says, do great work and then tell everybody about it. Or ideally have other people talk about it, right? Yeah. And so that’s like this it always comes back to distilling and realizing that it’s a bunch of simple steps done exceptionally well.

[00:45:01] Consistently. And then once you do ’em consistently, then you pick up the frequency and it’s usually not it’s usually not this thing where it’s like there’s this magical thing, that these guys that are killing it know and they’re not telling us. It’s no it’s not that.

[00:45:15] It’s like you have a hard time being disciplined and consistent and focusing on the work in front of you and having a path and a plan. In nutrition. My, my number one habit in nutrition for people to be successful is plan, prepare, cook. It’s got nothing to do with macro. It’s got nothing to do with calories and how much protein.

[00:45:33] It’s if you can make sure that you plan, prepare, and cook. And if you can’t cook, planning is like, Hey, I’m gonna have a meal delivery service for lunch. Yeah. Because I struggle with lunch. I’m gonna go to this cafe instead of eating the cafeteria ’cause they have shitty food and they don’t match my goals.

[00:45:47] You just know what you’re gonna do the next day and you have a plan for it. Because no path and plan equals default. And default is struggle because it’s where you are right now and you don’t like where you are, right? So you can’t just get up tomorrow morning and go today I’m gonna do better.

[00:46:04] What’s your plan for that? I don’t have it, but I’m gonna, with willpower, I’m just gonna do better. It’s achi, try harder, bro. Yeah, exactly. Just try harder. That’s it. And it, it doesn’t work that way. But business is the same again, when we started asset principles, right? And, there’s underlyingly, there’s principles of behaviors that underlie our training, that underlie our nutrition habits to underlie our sleep, stress management and they do the same thing with sales, marketing, content, all these different things.

[00:46:33] So what I’m, you know what, I’m a big, I would say fan of, or what I would like to consider myself an alchemist for others in that area is like breaking it down and going look. We’ve found the daily, weekly, and monthly things that you have to do to get you or should I say, forget about, yes, you got a destination, but to move you in the right direction, right?

[00:46:54] And so now, and of course it doesn’t mean that you’re gonna be a hundred percent on, on path because unfortunately, if that was the case and you just rolled out a plan and everybody did it, everybody be rich and in the best shape of their lives and all that good stuff. But at least here you have direction.

[00:47:10] And if you can have accountability and if you can have a community that ends up, being your tribe that you had heard to their standards, which I think is really important. I’m tapping into the culture part here a little bit. And again, on, in a business realm, why do people do really good when they go into mastermind or coaching is because everybody there.

[00:47:30] It’s pushing to achieve an improvement in their business, right? So that becomes the standard of the tribe. Hey, the standard of the tribe is that every day we improve our customer experience, but then every day we’re gonna market and then we’re gonna improve our systems, right? So now you’re in that group, you’re like, oh, I’m gonna do that too.

[00:47:48] Just if you come to, ground the gym, you’re like, people from all, like all ages, shapes, sizes, ethnicities, cultures, you name it. But there’s a common goal. Everybody wants to get healthier, fitter, look better, right? Get stronger, improve their performance. And so there is a standard of the tribe, right?

[00:48:07] And there is a culture. This is how we do things here. So I think that, again, I think environment is one of the fastest ways to change behaviors. And insert yourself into an environment where, What you want to achieve is actually the norm of the tribe. And so I think that’s so powerful, because to me culture is, when you say like, how we do things here, it’s almost a compass of values, right? And by the way, like everybody writes out values. It’s become the cool thing to do. Here’s our values. And but I’m like, man, like what if, what if you had somebody that’s never been in your business or your training or your gym or anything else, walked in and they’re just there for a week and they’re just writing out, like basically forget about quotes on the walls and the they would go, here’s what I think you, your values are based on what I see.

[00:48:59] Right? Based on the, how people operate, the coaches, the owner, even the clients and it have stuff to say That’s your values, right? Not that, because it’s like you can write whatever the hell you want down and sounds cool. But it’s more so what do people see and how do you show up?

[00:49:18] And so if, and this is one of the exercises in the book too, where it’s just like, all right create your values now let’s operationalize them. So one of ours is, leave it better than you found it. It was one of the summit sayings as well, right? And so I explained this and said, there’s a micro and a macro level to that value.

[00:49:37] The micro level is like, when a person comes in for a training session, we have to leave them better than we found them. Did they leave in a better mood? I even have a question. This is part of, you can see how these things gel together, but like coaching and culture, I say, Hey, listen, how would you wanna, like when you leave here today, how do you wanna feel?

[00:49:57] I’ll ask my client that. And a lot of times they’ll be like, I don’t know. Man, how you feeling right now? It’s like, how do you wanna feel? I’ll like, man, I’m exhausted right now. I wanna feel energized. Okay. Let’s say we had a full body training session with, four sets of three heavy trap bar deadlifts and I don’t know what, I’m like, I might change that up a little bit, right?

[00:50:16] I’m like, you know what? We’re gonna keep the intensity high. Get the volume lower. Let’s stimulate, not violate, at the end we might do a mobility like circuit with some breathing and they’re leaving and man, I feel great. Okay. So I did I gave them the feeling that they wanted. Okay, so my point being is that connects to leave them better than you found them, right?

[00:50:37] It might be a thing where somebody’s having a bad day, some shit happened in life that’s uncontrollable, but at the end you just go and behind the counter you grab a $25 Nike gift card and you go, Hey listen, I love you. Like Nike, like I do. Hey, I appreciate you. Boom. You give ’em the gift card, you go get, I love these new shirts that they got, these rifle.

[00:50:54] Get one of them right? And they’re like, what the man for that moment? That made their day. You made their day right. You left them better than you found them. Okay. On the macro level, I talked to this team, to, to our team the whole time. Like we’ve become famous for this in the industry is that, we’ve now ran 750 plus charity events.

[00:51:15] Like we used to do it every Saturday, pre covid. We still do ’em. We just had an event, now it’s a month and a half ago for happy bundles, which is basically they donate and give either clothes, toys financials to families with kids with cancer an amazing organization. And one of the I would say, The fans of the Sea Wolves came in and, we were, we already raised over three grand and this guy came in and wrote a $20,000 check.

[00:51:40] So we Oh wow. Raised $23,000. And over the course of the last 15 years, we’ve raised hundreds of thousands of dollars. Tons of food, tons of clothes, like for hundreds of different organizations now to that’s leaving it better than you found it. But on a more macro scale, as far as like our community, right?

[00:51:57] Renton. Now on a macro scale, my mission is to leave the industry better than I found it. Which is, that’s why I’m like creating so much content, giving ’em out for free, writing the book, and in another book after that, I speak at more events than I probably should as far as like how my schedule’s already insane.

[00:52:13] But it’s, it is, it’s a driving force and a value, but it’s operationalized, right? So I can sit down with my team or with people and go, here’s this value. How does this look like in real life? And I can ask other coaches, tell me how this, gimme an example of a micro or macro. Of leaving it better than you found it.

[00:52:34] And they’ll be able to say what that means to them. That’s an operationalized value. Or for us, another one that’s big is 1% better every day. We’re the education part of it. I, and this is not opinionated, I don’t wanna sound arrogant in Sarah, but like we do more continuing education.

[00:52:48] Any gym in this country, this year we’ll have 11 certifications or seminars. Nice. We’ve been averaging anywhere from nine to 11 for the last eight years. On top of the summits we’ve now had 160, of the world’s top people, from nutrition to training to this, that you name it, that have come through and did either a seminar certification or in staff, and we already got seven booked for next year, and it is not even the end of the year.

[00:53:09] Again, that’s operationalized, it’s not a thing that I can, that I just say it and then it’s oh, I. Where, are you guys, do you read, do you take courses? Do you Yes, actually, Hey, we have reading material. We give courses to coaches. I fly out all the time to learn, but then this is how many events come here.

[00:53:27] And so that, it’s an important thing because it sounds very woo. And trust me, like I, in the beginning of the, when I was in the industry, the same thing. It’s people talk about values and stuff like that, and you’re like and you don’t really, you’re younger and you don’t know.

[00:53:38] And then I, I started, I was obsessive about reading biographies of people that I looked up to, and Richard Brans the world and Tony Shai, r i p of Zappos, and on it goes. And everywhere you’d see this theme, values of the company, here’s how I developed them.

[00:53:53] Here I, here’s how I came to that point, and I started being more and more man okay. And then you start creating values that you think are like, I think this is cool. And again, you evolve and you learn, but. I actually now am much more I would say coach much more on that side and go look, let’s just figure out three to five, like this will change, this will develop.

[00:54:13] But the thing is that like you have to be able to say, when people come in and say, how do we do these things around here? You can’t say a thing and then it doesn’t show up. It actually makes it even worse, right? Because I don’t know, you got a model on the wall, right? And then everybody’s this doesn’t fucking happen here.

[00:54:29] Like it’s it may, it makes it worse, just like we talked about, if you don’t have great coaching customer experience and culture, but you’re like, I figured out a ad and a campaign and a challenge that’s gonna really get a lot of people through the doors, and what you end up doing is those people come and they go yeah, that wasn’t that good.

[00:54:44] Or they might be like, man, that sucked. And now they tell others. And I think the statistic is that, a person that’s had a bad experience will tell seven to eight times more people and than a person that’s had a good experience, right? So essentially, if you don’t get that thing in check, What happens is that you now have created marketing with a megaphone that your place sucks, right?

[00:55:05] And you talk about a demise. One number, ’cause again, I think I said this earlier, and I, and you have to be able to create an assessment, right? Assessment proceeds awareness. Awareness proceeds change. And, my thing is check your attrition, right? So if you’re, I, ideally your attrition would be about 3%.

[00:55:23] That’s pretty damn good. Five is still acceptable. It’s not horrible. But if you’re more than 5% attrition like red, like alarm, right? Why I would say coaching, customer experience, culture, like 80% of your effort should be there because if you do all this other stuff and your attrition is high, it’s just saying that you don’t have a good product or service.

[00:55:49] And Hormoz says this, now I agree with it, right? If you can create an exceptional service and product, the marketing is so much more powerful because the people that come in end up referring more people doing word of mouth, there’s all these intangibles that actually just compounds the marketing.

[00:56:08] Like he says, if you don’t have a good product or service, you’re gonna spend the rest of your life marketing like crazy, right? To basically get by and be okay. Maybe, right? Because people keep coming and going and saying, this is not that good. So I see this a lot, right? Where it’s, you’re not looking at the quality of things.

[00:56:28] And the thing is, you gotta keep improving all the time. Going back to that 1% better, the mentality. I’ve been in business for, 17 years and like this last year, I’ve had a realization. I’m like, man we’re exceptional at this thing. And we’re very good at this thing.

[00:56:41] We’re okay here, but man, we’re not even, we’re not good here. We gotta make this better, and it’s like new levels, new devils, right? The moment that you become like, haha. This is it’s like the Jim Collins book, right? Good to great. Like when do companies start falling apart?

[00:56:55] It’s like at their peak, because they start thinking that, they’re holier than th and nothing can go wrong, and they’re the shit and all that, right? And so it is that’s part of the process is like, how do we continue to get better? How do we keep improving? And again, that, I think that’s a, a nice marker to have is to look at your attrition.

[00:57:12] By the way, Mo most gym owners or coaches that I ask, what’s your attrition? No idea. Yeah. Which by, it’s simple. If you have a hundred clients and five of them leave every month, that’s 5% attrition, right? Three of them leave every month. That’s 3% attrition. If you have five clients and then one of them leaves, that’s 20% attrition, right?

[00:57:32] Again, when you’re starting off, maybe that’s a little bit more aggressive. But listen, the, you should, that’s what you should work on. That’s what you should shoot for that three, and until you don’t get there, or to five, you should continue to improve your product and service. And I’ll say another thing about the numbers part of it KPIs, key performance indicators.

[00:57:51] I think they’re in everything that you do, they’re there, right? If I got, I’m training my elite N F L guys or Cy Young Award, major league baseball guys, what are we doing? We’re looking at throwing speed. We’re looking at, we’re measuring Gunter for mobility on shoulders.

[00:58:08] We’re looking at, depending on what the, V B T monitors for Hey, your, your strength speed is low. We gotta improve that. Your, your a tackle. And this is like your weakness. All right, cool. Like we have KPIs to see, this is where you are, this is where you want to go.

[00:58:22] In, in, in training and coaching, it’s okay, the KPIs that are baselined, by the way, is leads generated appointments set up, so that’s strategy sessions, clients converted, and then it’s, whether they were to a trial or to a membership. We see that and then we look at upgrades, downgrades, and pauses.

[00:58:42] And then we essentially look at like revenue that’s like super baseline, right? And plus my, by the way, plus minus net, which is a really big one, right? So five net new clients means that if you lost four, it means you have to get nine, right? Because I wanna have five net plus per month. And so having those KPIs are crucial because those KPIs will tell you, where there’s a problem.

[00:59:05] So if I’m generating a lot of leads, but I’m not sending a bunch of appointments, then that means that we need to improve that. Basically we need to improve our follow up, right? If we get a good amount of appointments, but we don’t convert to memberships, then that means we need to work on sales, right?

[00:59:23] So again, we have to have something that creates, it’s the assessment that precedes awareness, that precedes change.

[00:59:34] Dr Mike T Nelson: Yeah. That’s awesome. And then could you list the KPIs again? One more time real quick? Oh, I think my internet froze here.

[00:59:42] Luka Hocevar: Hold up. Lemme see if it’s my one. Gimme one second.

[01:00:06] I think it might’ve been your one that froze.

[01:00:09] Dr Mike T Nelson: Yeah, I think so. My video’s kind of froze, but lemme turn the video off for just a second, see if that fixes it. But I got the first two and then you had, I think you had four KPIs, correct. And then you had the details after that.

[01:00:21] Luka Hocevar: Cool. Yeah. I’ll just go over them again.

[01:00:22] So the main KPIs is, leads generated. And by the way, when you do leads generated, I think it’s very important to like, always write out where they’re coming from, right? Because that constantly gives you insight on, again, the 2080 rule for me is what’s the 20% of leads that generated to 80% of business?

[01:00:39] Because whatever I find out, like I might wanna do more of that. So leads generated, then it’s appointment set first. That first us, that’s a strategy session, so actual in-person sit downs, if you have an online business, that means not, how many calls you’d get on to be able to sell somebody from there.

[01:00:53] You have conversions, people that converted their trial or a member, right? That paid. Then from there you’d have upgrades, downgrades freezes, which is all like normal stuff. And then net clients, so you have a plus minus net, right? So if you lost four clients but signed up 10, you’re net six.

[01:01:12] I think that number is a really important number. Because you can literally look ahead and say, Hey, if we sign up four net new clients per month, that’s 48 this year, that’s gonna increase our membership. 48, at average of, for instance, 300 bucks a month, you can go wow, that’s $180,000 extra per year.

[01:01:28] That, again, it comes back down. Now I can say, now I can say, what are the things that I need to do daily, weekly, and monthly to, improve these things? But the thing is the KPIs give you an insight on what’s working and not working again, right? Like we, I mentioned it earlier, but if I’m generating 20 leads, but only five of them are set up for a strategy session, woo.

[01:01:52] That’s 25%. That’s low. We should be shooting for 50%. And, if only x, y, z of those convert, and it’s like conversions less than six outta 10, we gotta work on that. We gotta work on sales. Like how was that strategy session looking like? What are we doing? Did we, did we handle objections before they even came?

[01:02:09] Do our coaches know how to handle objections or to pay the person that’s the salesperson? Those are all like really again it’s if somebody tells you how’s your nutrition? That’s pretty good. Okay. Everybody says pretty good. Yeah, it’s pretty good. It’s always pretty good, right?

[01:02:20] But then you go like, all right let’s write everything down right. And be, and the thing is that even before a coach actually pinpoints things out, if they write everything down as they’re, they end up going usually Ooh, damn, I didn’t know that these snacks were 700 calories every time I ate them.

[01:02:38] Boom. Assessment proceeded awareness and awareness is what needs proceeds change. Because when you look at that, that essentially the behavior change chart of, you have un unconscious incompetence. Yeah. Ma yeah. And you need that assessment to go oh shit. And then you have basically, conscious incompetence.

[01:02:57] ’cause you’re clear, you’re aware of it. Now you can work on it and you can create a path and a plan that takes you to, conscious competence. It’s Hey, you gotta work really hard on it until you develop these habits. And then eventually, hopefully you get to, unconscious competence and you’re just like, on a daily, that’s what you do.

[01:03:12] But there has to be something that makes you aware. And I’m baffled by, and by the way, I, I don’t wanna judge because it’s I’ve been through every phase of this in my life. I’ve made all the mistakes. It where I sit down with the owner and ask them a lot of questions or a coach and just ask them questions and they don’t know.

[01:03:25] But what that means is like, They don’t have awareness of what’s working and not working and just getting that awareness could give them a direction, right? Because it’s here’s why things are sucking, but you know what, this is good because now we know and there is a path and a plan to fix this, whether it’s improving your service, your retention, your follow-up.

[01:03:44] Hey you actually need more marketing poles in the water. You have none. You’re just you’re throwing shit up against the wall and you don’t even know, and hoping things stick, but you’re not, you have no plan. And the thing is that can be feel hurtful and be like, oh my God.

[01:03:57] But I’m like, but now we have a starting point. Before we were in the fog. Now we’re clear. Now it’s not good, but we’re clear and we know where we want to go. And again, like we I’ll say barely scratch the surface of the three Cs, right? Because like the book is currently at 450 pages, so I.

[01:04:15] It’s, Sean Harrison was like, dude, I have to like, I can’t even, you know too much about this shit. And then it becomes like hard at editing and we going back and forth because my whole goal was like, this book will be like, actionable. It’s not like a, it’s like you could open up a chapter and go I’m gonna implement these things in this chapter and it’s gonna make your coaching and business better and grow tactically.

[01:04:37] It’s like principles and boom, here’s tactics. Do this thing. And, if we went to the other threes, the content, the communication and we touched on it a little bit For sure. And the sales part, it would be the same thing. You like, I can assess it, we just did a call with one person.

[01:04:51] It’s man we really wanna improve our, not only like our engagement ’cause like we wanna improve our advertising, we wanna improve our positioning in our area, like our local area. I. We want to make a plan with the content, and say, what are you currently doing with the content?

[01:05:05] And it, it was basically, we just were like, let’s go over each thing, from emails to blogs, to every platform, every medium. And when we just put it all there, they were like, oh shit, we don’t do anything really. We do so little. So this thing that we want to grow, we haven’t really been doing anything.

[01:05:22] So it just became about let’s fi what do you feel the most comfortable doing? And like one of the guys is I, he likes to write, one of the guys is like, more confident in video. Cool. Here’s what you’re doing with writing. Here’s what you’re doing with video. You got this many coaches.

[01:05:35] Get a commitment. Do a bonus. If they’re doing two videos per week, every week. Okay, now you got four coaches. That’s another eight pieces of content every week. Here’s how you distribute it. Here’s how you turn it into ads. But the kicker was, it started with. An assessment that created awareness and in a path and a plan.

[01:05:52] And I don’t care if it’s training, if it’s nutrition, if it’s sleep, if it’s, deep health and you do labs, like if it’s business, if it’s marketing, it’s always the same thing, right? Like you’re gonna have to first get clear on what is your point A on the g p s, right? What, like, where are you even starting?

[01:06:09] People a lot of times are like, I wanna figure out where I want to go. And I’m like, but first, let’s figure out where you’re even starting. You don’t know where you are, in a map. Cool, now we know where you’re at. Oh, it’s a shitty place, but you know what, we know where you’re at. Here’s point B, here’s where you wanna go.

[01:06:24] Put it into the G P s. And now it’s okay, it’s gonna show you a path and a plan. And just like any g p s, you move along and then there’s a roadblock and you gotta reroute and the whole shebang. But guess what? Nonetheless, the moment you have a point A and a point B, the. You have guidance and accountability in the community, like you get there faster and you get there better.

[01:06:47] Yeah, no,

[01:06:48] Dr Mike T Nelson: I love that. And the nice part too is I always look at what are things that are also very scalable? And the nice part about content, especially now, is that it’s pretty scalable. Like you put a post on, say Instagram, or you put a post on YouTube, or obviously I’m biased because I like a lot of newsletter stuff.

[01:07:06] You’re only doing that content piece once. But you could have unlimited traffic, you could have a huge newsletter list, you could have a small list. And it’s, again, back to the process of executing that thing. But you know that if you get more viewers, you get more people on your newsletter, you’re still really doing the same thing.

[01:07:26] So I think sometimes people think that when I’m doing this, oh my God, like I’m gonna a year from now I’m gonna have to create 10 times the amount of content. It’s not really again, you might be able to create more, which is great, but the people you’re interacting with can be an exponential thing.

[01:07:41] That doesn’t mean the work that you’re putting in has to be exponential. It’s usually almost the exact same thing that you’re doing.

[01:07:47] Luka Hocevar: Actually, I think too is as you get better, I think that a good reason to make more money is that, so you can take some of that money and invest it into people that do things better than you and faster than you.

[01:07:56] Oh, sure. And now you have ai and I, if you don’t mind, I’m gonna share some tactical stuff. Yeah, please. I love, I getting on shows, I love to talk about philosophy and principles and stuff like that, but I like for people, hopefully in this episode they hear like a whole bunch of stuff that’s oh, I can go do this right now.

[01:08:12] I think that’s an important factor. You take this is just one example. Opus AI is a te basically technology. Literally you drop in your any YouTube link video and I got a ton of podcast videos. I got a ton of long form vlog videos, and so I just drop that in and it’s 30 minutes and it’ll chop up 10 different reels with subtitles, with emojis on ’em by itself, really?

[01:08:35] And it picks it up. And the thing is, and it picks it based on headlines. And lemme tell you this, ah, it does a pretty I would say three to four of them I can use. But it’s 200 bucks for the year and allows you to do 60 hours or something like, like of some absurd amount. Basically I broke it down.

[01:08:48] It’s it’s a dollar or 50 cents to make that real for me, right? Yeah. But the thing is, I can literally put in two of those video links and go do something else. Come back and I got 20 reels. So that’s one example, of, of technology or Yes, I’m paying somebody too now that, I, I batch shoot a whole in a batch.

[01:09:04] I shoot a whole lot of videos and then make, they make ’em really nice and engaging with the emojis. With the pictures. Yeah, with the videos and all that stuff. And and again, that will be distributed on multiple platforms. But then, another thing that is really valuable is like the moment that I see a video that does better, right?

[01:09:21] So meaning that’s really easy to see. So let’s say I put up a reel and most reels get, 15 to 20,000 views or something like that. But this one organically is already at 35,000. So what is it telling me? It’s telling me that people are liking this already organically. Okay, cool. So now I’m gonna put some money behind it.

[01:09:40] Yeah. Because I already know people love it. I’m

[01:09:41] Dr Mike T Nelson: gonna go already know working, right? It’s all, you’ve got the proof in front of you.

[01:09:45] Luka Hocevar: Correct. So now it’s I don’t, I’m not guessing. I know it from the data and then I’m just putting fuel to the fire and put some more money behind it. So now, over whatever course of week said a hundred, 200,000 and that’s, also social proof.

[01:09:58] But now I can take that content and turn it into an ad, right? Yep. And this is what’s working really well, actually, I talked to Gary V about years ago about this and started doing this. He’s Luca, just turn your great content into advertising, right? So I shoot a reel of my small group. That, literally real time, like you see people training, it’s not fake, it’s not, super edited, whatever.

[01:10:19] And it does well. Okay, now I promote it and what I’ll do is I’ll actually promote it to emerging markets. So on Facebook I’ll do Mexico, Saudi Arabia, India, I remember you talking about this. Yeah. And it’s like you’re getting, like right now, if I showed you a stat, it’ll it blow your mind.

[01:10:33] Like I had some Facebook account managers that were like, I don’t believe this. They had to go into my thing. Because for $35 it was like, 200,000 views, and it was basically 0.0 0, 0 0 3 cents per view. If you look at the, my app on Facebook, it showed zero. It looked, it was basically free, but it was super cheap, right?

[01:10:52] So now I spent barely any money. Now I’m gonna take that once, that ra once that, and it’s only gonna be views, so I’m not gonna have any learn more, sign up, anything. But now I got a half a thou, half a million or a million views on it, or three quarter million views on it, a thousand shares, a hundred comments.

[01:11:07] Then I take it back locally and now I run it locally and send it to a landing page, or make it a Facebook lead ad, right? And get, the thing is you’re getting five times cheaper leads. ’cause people are going like, whoa, this is a local gym. Holy shit, look at this engagement. Like it, it must be good.

[01:11:25] So again it’s like it’s psychology and talk about scalability because like I can put some money behind it, I can target and then go to sleep and it’s doing its job, right? So it comes back down, but what does it come back down to, right? That I’m trying to focus on making really good stuff because if I make really good stuff, a lot of the other things will be so much easier.

[01:11:45] Because imagine how much ads, you’d have to run to make a shitty thing be seen a lot. It’s just, yeah. It’s so much, it’s so much more and people still won’t care for it. So it’s that’s a little bit of the magic trick there, right? And it’s and that’s tactical. And now we do, by the way, for example, we got prompts inside of our our business mastermind.

[01:12:02] Like we just did this thing where we have prompts for AI that we’ll write copy. And it’s basically take your, let’s say it’s busy moms and it’s Hey, busy moms for this area. Can you find all the obstacles the pain, the problems, the struggles of, a 30 to 45 year old busy mom in this area?

[01:12:21] And write it as if it was Eugene Schwartz, the famous copywriter that was writing it. And then it starts writing, and then you give it, four more different prompts and these ads are coming out. Holy shit. And by the way, I’m, I’ve spent a lot of my life doing copywriting, but that’s so much more helpful because in minutes, it’s writing up some really good stuff and I tweak it a little bit and edit it and bam, we’re putting it up on this ad and it’s Forex outperforming some other stuff that, was written off the top of my dome, or it was written off of somebody else.

[01:12:48] That’s a good copywriter. And again, I’m sharing these things because it’s like, how do we use technology, to help us? Again, it won’t replace you, it will help you. It’ll just help you out. I look at it as an assistant hold. I’m just finding this to plug in because my computer’s on its last oh yeah.

[01:13:03] Last juice and I don’t want, I don’t want it want it to kick us out. Hold on one second. Yeah. And I’ll just

[01:13:08] Dr Mike T Nelson: add to that, that I’ve. Played around a fair amount with ai and what I found so far, and again, this I’m sure will change, is initially for writing. What it spits out I found is pretty horrible. But if you can give it something to revise or changes in phrases or listing or iterations or edits, or just a way of creating different ideas and viewing it differently.

[01:13:38] So like you said, revise as like Jean Schwartz. I’ll sometimes do that with stuff I write. I’ll just pick some other random voice. I’ll say, okay, revise this in a certain voice. I’ll leave it, sit for a day. I’ll come back to it the next day. I may not even like the voice that it was written in, even though I wrote it originally, but some of the phrases that it puts in, you’re like, oh, that’s good, or, that’ll give you an idea of how to change that phrase to a better phrase. So I found it’s this really cool Stepping stone that it’s not the final product per se, but it gives me ideas that I wouldn’t have had otherwise, which I find is like super valuable.

[01:14:14] Luka Hocevar: It’s exactly that. It’s almost, and this is the, this is myself for when people started saying ah, you don’t even have to be a good writer anymore.

[01:14:19] I’m like, no. Being like, it’s one of the four, like in my presentation, I’m always talking about writing is one of the four skills that will never go out. Yeah. And, but it’s almost AI can do research for you, right? What I, what I ended up doing is I just fed it. My writing, my emails, my blog posts, my like, and then, the other part where it’s valuable is for ss e o articles that I don’t actually want anybody to read.

[01:14:41] Sure. Yep. We’ll do s e o articles that have, certain keywords for the website, for the local area that are hidden. I’m not gonna drive traffic to Yeah. But what I started doing now, and again, to be tactical here is I. I, I’ve wrote for a lot of big publications, fromt Nation to bodybuilding.com, to Men’s Health and stuff like that, which, I’ll still I think it’s good for positioning.

[01:15:00] Yep. But, then I started going wh why, like, why am I not going back to writing the best stuff for my own website? Yeah. And not only did I do that, I went to a lot of, which I’m gonna reach out to you too, by the way Yeah. Andrew Code, Sean Hyon yep. We co-write articles Lee Boys, I got a bunch of people that are gonna write for vigor and I’ll pay them.

[01:15:18] I’m like, it’s not folks will be like, Hey, I’ll do a free, I’m like, nah, man, I’ll pay you. And the kicker is now we’re getting like great articles on my website that are educating, but we’re driving traffic there. So I’m gonna spend money, but I’m gonna drive traffic to my site.

[01:15:31] Then I can retarget for specific things. But again, I’m not, I want quality writers that do stuff in the real world writing and not go oh, I’m just gonna write ar I articles because, if the AI just wrote it, you read it and you’re like, dude, there’s no there’s no soul.

[01:15:45] No. It’s very, you know who said this? Killer Mike

[01:15:48] Dr Mike T Nelson: Technical. Oh,

[01:15:49] Luka Hocevar: I love that dude. Yeah. I love that he had an interview with Joe Rogan and it was like, yeah. Was a great interview. He said something, he said, we beat ai. Joe Ro Rogan was like, what do you mean? It’s there’s this algorithm that AI calculates this, that the other, and it couldn’t figure it out.

[01:16:01] But he said, here’s the thing, man. It’s an intangible. But like with music, right? Or maybe even with writing, like when somebody wrote it with their heart and soul, I don’t give a you can feel that I don’t give a shit what anybody says, man. I’ll read it and I’m like, dude, like this person was writing that from here.

[01:16:18] You know what I mean? I think music’s the same way. And I think that that will never go away. So it becomes, I. I think people will make it like a bit of a crutch. And I tend, and I tend to be like, let it help you, let it be your assistant. Let it cut out. The work that maybe is kinda like tedious, but like the craft is the craft, right?

[01:16:35] And it’s man, great writers are gonna, I actually think that great writers are gonna and this is gonna be a compounding effect. ’cause people that don’t know how to write great, you’re gonna have this crutch and try to do it this way. And it’s like the great writers are gonna have some help and it’s just gonna be significantly better.

[01:16:50] Again, you can’t get away from the damn work and getting good at the fucking thing that you do. It’s just, yeah. The moment that you start, we said it earlier it’s like the moment you wanna do that new thing that’s gonna solve everything. And it’s dude, the craft is the craft.

[01:17:02] And it’s like the amount of hours that I’ve put into specific areas of the coaching craft, it’s, I can’t even comp, I can’t, I’ve stopped counting, I don’t know. And I don’t care because I’m just like, how do I continue to get better? And I looked at, I look at everything as a practice. I think this is the most valuable thing.

[01:17:17] I got a new coach right now, actually two, two, that I’m onboarding. They’re, they’ve been here like actually working for a month, but before that they got onboarded and, struggling with some stuff. And I said, look, I said, Blake, you have to look at this. Practice, I’m gonna go back to basketball.

[01:17:33] And it’s listen, man, like whatever it is that you’re not good at, like you, you wouldn’t expect, like if I gave you, it’s like, Hey, you don’t play ball. If I was like, dude, go pull, do two dribbles left, pull up jumper. You know what I mean? And out of 20, how many are you’re gonna hit, dude, it might be like three.

[01:17:47] You’re gonna suck. You won’t be surprised that you suck because you’re like, this is not my natural thing. I don’t practice it. But would it say if you went for 30 minutes a day, five days a week for the next 60 days, you know you’re gonna be making five to six out of those shots, you’re gonna feel way more confident because you practiced it.

[01:18:05] I’m like, the thing that you’re right now that you’re stressing about, you need to just break it back down and go I have not practiced it, so I have not earned it. I’ve not earned this. And that’s okay. Take and take again, writing articles, take, putting up an ad, take the customer experience part of it that we said, and the shortcut is, Learning from the people that have been there done that are still doing it now.

[01:18:26] ’cause you’ll cut through the bullshit, but you’re still gonna have to do the reps. Oh yeah. And you’re still gonna have to do the practice that you can’t. So the thing is, the people that want to get away from that is I can cut your, if you come here, I can coach you up faster than, I believe almost anywhere else.

[01:18:40] But I still can’t get you to not do the work. You’re gonna have to do the damn reps and the more reps that you get, the better you’re gonna be. And that’s just if you wanna be in business, if you wanna be great in the fitness industry and you wanna coach in person, online, whatever it is that you wanna do, like you practice, build skillset sets, build skill sets, build identity, and then build your future.

[01:18:59] And build your life. And you just, whatever it is that you want, you haven’t practiced it enough, man, that’s really the answer to it. And if we zoom out and go back to, because we’re talking about the book, that’s really what the book is it becomes as like these six Cs, right?

[01:19:12] The seven C is consistency, which is. Keep doing this shit over and create a system for it. But you’re gonna have to do it. Unfortunately, the book is not read this chapter, fucking do one thing and you’re gonna, your business will blow up. You’ll be millionaire. It’s not that there, there’s no such thing.

[01:19:26] But I, I do feel like it, it makes it a lot less stressful when you can break things down and go here’s what I need to practice every day. And over time, like you will really, you’ll build up your confidence, you’ll build up your skillset, your results will get better. Your co, your client’s results will get better, your business will grow.

[01:19:42] And you gotta keep going back to the process that leads you in the right direction.

[01:19:46] Dr Mike T Nelson: Yeah. It’s like you said, as we wrap up, like knowing. What direction you’re going in, ensuring you’re doing higher quality before quantity. And then it’s just the violent consistency of whatever it is, just doing that day in and day out.

[01:20:01] And like you said, there is shortcuts, but the shortcut is what things to do are gonna get you there faster. It’s not skipping the things to do.

[01:20:12] Luka Hocevar: No, exactly. And I think that a lot of people are doing the right things, by the way. I just think that they’re drastically underdoing them. Yeah. And it’s a thing that in this world, people are sometimes even blasphemy for me to say something like this, right?

[01:20:23] Because, you need four hour work weeks. Four, four day, eight hour work weeks and this, that, and the other. I, look, I keep going back to this by the way. I will raise my hand here and say like I’m speaking to people that want to be exceptional at what they do. I’m not speaking to people that are like, I wanna be mediocre at the thing I.

[01:20:40] I like, I can’t help you for real. I can’t help you because I’m gonna speak in a way that talks about the things that you need to be, to do, to be exceptional at your thing. And build an exceptional business. Not I guess if you kept, going down the path and a certain point in time, you’re like, I’m fine, cool, do that.

[01:20:57] But my, if you went to Kobe Bryant today a lot of stuff is happening. That’s almost like people going up to Kobe and saying Kobe, you, you train too much. You’re, you’re, it’s too much Kobe. It’s no, he wants to be the greatest of all ever. You know what I mean?

[01:21:10] Like that, those, that’s what it takes. So there’s a price to pay. You gotta figure out this other thing. I think it’s important I’ll finish on this now, I promise, but I, this is important is that there’s a requirement for the thing that you want. There’s always a requirement, and I think it’s important to get clear on what that is.

[01:21:27] For example, if you’re like, I deadlift one 20, but I wanna deadlift 500, but I can only go train once a week. I say, look, that’s not what’s required. It’s gonna take more than that, quite a bit more than that, right? Or, I wanna build up my social media account, but I’m posting once a week.

[01:21:45] It’s gonna take a lot more than that. I want to be very as lean and healthy as I can possibly be. But, I drink three nights a week and I go and eat processed food 50% of the time and don’t look at what I’m eating. We could go down the list of all these different things is it is like, Hey, I want to scale my business, but I never track kpi.

[01:22:01] It’s like there’s a requirement to anything that you want to achieve, and it’s find the people that have achieved it and they’ll tell you the requirements to, and what I hear a lot sometimes man, Luca, I want this right here. Your behaviors are here. And I’m like, this is what’s required. Your behaviors need to take up a significant notch.

[01:22:18] Like you need to work more, you need to be more focused on this, you need to do this, you need to invest in that. And if it’s, if the answer is I don’t really wanna do that. It’s that’s okay, I’m not gonna judge you for it. Yeah, totally. But guess what? The thing that you said you want, you ain’t getting that.

[01:22:31] Yeah. Because it’s, ’cause there’s more required. So that is an important factor. And it, again, when you break it down, ’cause big goals can be ha can be scary and there’d be a lot of stuff around it. But if you break it down into, practices daily, weekly, monthly, right? And you have an organized schedule time management is a huge thing in success, right?

[01:22:51] It becomes less scary. And if you can learn how to like, be present and be where your feet are and then, be excellent at the thing that’s right in front of you as, as basic as it sounds, in two to three years, you can be in a significantly different place than you are right now.

[01:23:06] Yeah.

[01:23:07] Dr Mike T Nelson: Awesome. Thank you so much for all your time and all the tips and everything. Where can people find more about you? I know you’ve got a whole bunch of stuff online.

[01:23:15] Luka Hocevar: Yeah, there’s I’m, I’ll share the stuff that leads to other things too. On, on Instagram it’s at Luka Hvar, so L U K A H O C E V A R.

[01:23:23] On YouTube, if you put my name in my channel will pop up there. I have a podcast called Vigor Life Podcast. It’s heavily, I would say oriented towards coaches. And I’ll say some fitness enthusiasts too, but definitely very oriented towards coaches. And I’ve got a bunch of courses and workshops at luca hvar dot com.

[01:23:40] And if you’re the area, it’s my gym’s in Renton, which is 10 minutes from downtown Seattle. So basically Seattle area. And that’s vigor ground fitness.com. Awesome.

[01:23:50] Dr Mike T Nelson: Thank you so much. I would highly encourage everyone to check out all this stuff you got going on. Always great information. And thank you once again for all your time today.

[01:23:57] Really appreciate it.

[01:23:58] Luka Hocevar: My pleasure, brother. Thank you,

[01:23:59] Dr Mike T Nelson: man. Thank you.

[01:24:02] [01:24:03] Mike T Nelson: Thank you very much for listening to the podcast. Huge thanks to Luca for coming on the podcast.

[01:24:09] It was awesome to finally meet him in person, speaking of live events, at the Raise the Bar seminar this past year. They will be having that again. We went last year. Unfortunately, we won’t be able to make it there live this year, but it was an amazing event. We loved it. So if you have the chance to go to that again, highly recommend it.

[01:24:28] I was great to finally meet Luca and Josevar in person. We’ve chatted for many years and literally almost missed each other many times. And big thanks to him for coming on the podcast and so willingly to share all of his knowledge all the time. I’ll make sure to check out all of his stuff. We’ll put links to everything.

[01:24:49] He has going on below here in your podcast player. Big thanks for listening to the podcast. Really appreciate it. If you want more from me, go to MikeTNelson.com/podcast. You’ll see all the podcasts I’ve been on and you can sign up to the newsletter, which is completely free. And most of my content actually goes out to the newsletter.

[01:25:12] So sign up there. If you want to also help us out, do you enjoy the podcast? Click the little subscribe link wherever podcast player or iTunes or whatever you’re using, forward it on to a friend who you think may enjoy it. Or drop me an email. You can reach me via the website, which is MikeTNelson.

[01:25:30] com. Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. Really appreciate it. Appreciate your time and working to get better at your craft. And we will talk to all of you once again, next week.

[01:25:45] Do you suppose they have any life on other planets? What do you care? You don’t have any life on this one!

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